Grand Voyager 2.8Crd Which Gearbox Will Fit?

[newtothis]

HI There guys,

 

so I have taken the plunge and purchased my first grand voyager. Its a 2005 2.8 crd and with 4th baby due any time I needed to get a 7 seater. Problem is the gearbox has broke. It is stuck in limp mode and after researching I have checked wiring, relay, earth straps etc...  I then removed the sump to find metal filings so I definitely need a new gearbox. Now after researching a hell of a lot I have found that this car is fitted with an A604 (41te) gearbox. So as im on a budget I jumped on fleabay to try to find a gearbox but they want around £500 for a second hand one that could break in 3 months but as mentioned 4th baby due I cant afford 2k for a rebuild. So heres my question......

 

The a604 (41te) gearbox is fitted on a range of vehicles, from what I can see all the internals are the same part numbers so could I take a gearbox from a petrol say 3.3 and fit it to my 2.8crd. Naturally I would use my ecu, but I cannot find a direct answer to this question but as I say a lot of research is telling me this may be possible. Any help or info is greatly appreciated :-)

[gordy]

Diesel to Diesel yes but Petrol to Diesel no as Bellhousing will be different... 

[newtothis]

Yes, that makes sense, however in theory could I change the internals into my bell housing? I am pretty good with tools and can strip and rebuild engines all day. I can get 3.3 gearbox for £100 and a new set of friction plates for £46. So if my theory is possible then in reality it's only a cost of £146 plus oil ad filter.

[Neilgibson]

Actually it is possible to use the petrol transmission in the diesel. I have been running one for 12 months. Firstly the casing. Providing it comes from a post 2001 car it will mate to the diesel. The earlier ones won't. The oil cooler pipes have different fittings. Just cut em and use hoses. Use the diesel torque converter as it's better suited to the torque of the diesel though I did use the petro tc and it's not noticeable. Finally be aware that the petrol tranny has a higher yes higher final drive ratio. If memory serves 29 mph per thousand revs in top as against 32 in the petrol. This makes the speedo reading slightly out because the output sensor on the transmission provides the speed data. One way round that is to use a motorcycle speedo healer on the output sensor. This uses an ecu so you can vary the signal and either correct the speedo or alter the change points by feeding the transmission ecu an altered signal. I do have a stock crd casing left over from my research if anyone wants to rebuild one using petrol tranny internals.

[newtothis]

Hi, so let me get this right, my research is correct even though everybody who sells gearboxes has said I'm incorrect. ??

 

It's nice to hear that somebody has actually tried and tested this as we all know the petrol gearboxes are far cheaper. I think I'm going to take the plunge and try. I don't mind the speedo being wrong as I usually just keep up with traffic.

 

Thank you

[Neilgibson]

I was going to keep it to myself. Could've made me a fortune! Chrysler have a long history of adapting existing bits rather than starting fresh. The 2.5 was only ever available as a manual because the 41 te casing didn't fit but after the facelift in 2001 all was good. Using a speedo healer on the output sensor ( about £60 ) effectively gives you the option of sports or economy transmission. The right gear casings are easily identifiable. The serial no. Ends with the letter a b c d or e on the casing. These are year letters, The a is 2001.

[newtothis]

I'm just glad I was reading everything correctly. It's not that I was being tight but I like to know that I'm not paying more than I need to.

[newtothis]

So just to confirm to everybody I have now repaired my vehicle using a gearbox from a 3.3 petrol voyager. I purchased a 52 plate with head gasket failure for £200.The car had done 68k with one owner and full service history. I drove the vehicle for 36 miles without fault and if im honest it was a shame to break the car as it drove perfectly. I figured for £200 I would have a go and see if it would work. Well the answer is yes all though there is 2 slight modifications you have to do.

 

1: On the 2.8 gearboxes you will find 2 bolt holes under the rear diff, the 3.3 only has one and its in the wrong place. Easy to sort just alloy weld and make second hole. (I suppose you could just ignore it because its only one bolt but I like things to be right)

2: the hoses at the front as Neil said are incorrect. Rather than using hose I simply unscrewed the fitting and replaced with the correct fitting from my 2.8 gearbox. Fits perfect.

 

I did use the torque converter from my 2.8 but looking the 3.3 would fit no worries. I have driven the car around 50 miles and all is perfect. So how much has it cost for this gearbox repair:

 

Scrap car £200

Gearbox oil and filter £36

total £236

 

But then guess what, as I have bought a full car I can now either break the full car which I haven't time to do or sell to scrap yard. I have chosen the later and they are collecting it and giving me £125. So this gearbox repair has cost me £111.

 

I did look at the internals prior to fitting and can also confirm they are the same. hope this helps somebody else in the future as on my quest to find a gearbox everybody told me it couldn't be done and that a gearbox is £500. Well they were wrong

[Neilgibson]

I didn't mention the diff bolt and wasn't as thorough as yourself so I can attest to the fact that ignoring it made no difference. Well there goes my scheme for selling petrol transmissions at inflated prices!

[newtothis]

its amusing how all the breakers and gearbox specialists inflate the prices for a 2.8 as opposed to the 3.3 when they are the same. Its not a small job taking 2 out and putting one in but then when it save you as much as what I saved its worth the hassle. Well the car is in for its mot in an hour so if I need any more parts they will be free aswell prior to the scrapper being collected :-)

 

Thanks Neil, your comment confirmed in my head to take the chance

[andyb2000]

Hi newtothis/Neilgibson,

 

Just about to dive into mine as looks like the flexplate is failing (Or damaged casing got into the flexplate to torque converter housing), any advice/steps on getting the box out and back in as it's a new one on us to have a go at so looking for any tips or steps on doing the job!

 

Thanks in advance.

[Neilgibson]

its amusing how all the breakers and gearbox specialists inflate the prices for a 2.8 as opposed to the 3.3 when they are the same. Its not a small job taking 2 out and putting one in but then when it save you as much as what I saved its worth the hassle. Well the car is in for its mot in an hour so if I need any more parts they will be free aswell prior to the scrapper being collected :-)

 

Thanks Neil, your comment confirmed in my head to take the chance

[Neilgibson]

I'm in Dartford Kent. Where are you? Do you notice the difference in the final drive ratio? Unfortunately it moves the torque converter clutch lock up point from an indicated 42 mph (already too high) to about 46 mph. High speed economy is probably better but not town driving. This is where a speedo healer is worth a go.

[gordy]

Silly me to say it wouldn't fit like other cars, but you went ahead and proved something that will be helpful to others. But somehow I feel telling that to the professionals you will be branded for Witchcraft. Well that's one job sorted complete with the knowledge that 3.3 Autobox fits the 2.8CRD. To say it fits, well it does but there are minor differences which can be overcome and may please the sceptics.  

[bignev]

BLOODY AWESOME YOU GUYS!!!!

 

Fantastic info some of us may be thankful for at some point hey!

 

And sometimes it's actually nice to be wrong, in a good way, hey gordy!?

[newtothis]

Got to say getting the gearbox out is a nightmare to do on your own like I did. Biggest tip I have is get the car as high as you can as the gearbox is bigger than you think.

 

Neil, I'm in Doncaster. After driving for a couple of days I've noticed that the economy round town is a little down but really not much. And considering I saved a packet on the repair it will take ages before I'm out of pocket lol.

 

The. Hugest thing that the professionals won't tell you is the internals are the same. parts are easily available these gearboxes from the American eBay and isn't that expensive. Jump on YouTube and there is a video showing how to strip and rebuild these gearboxes from start to finish. Anybody who can remove a gearbox should be able to rebuild one as they are so simple to strip as I was really intrigued to find out what had failed on mine.

 

So to the gearbox specialists out there I will apologise in advance for the loss of income

Edited March 28, 2017 by newtothis

[gordy]

Just a thought here. Seeing its a Petrol Autobox would a Petrol gearbox mount help in its installation.

[newtothis]

Mounts are exactly the same :-) other than the one bolt hole they fit perfectly.

[QinteQ]

All news to me, griss to the mill, and benefits all GV owners so congrats to the contributors.

[Wruffdiamond]

Hi. I know this is an old post.. 2.8 crd 2010. Fluid change ,then gearbox packed in, any ideas? Also it is correct a 3.3 petrol auto box will fit? Rockauto do complete service kits for a 3.3, how difficult would this be for a tryer, lol Any help please

[lessuth]

I think your 2010 Voyager has a 62TE , six speed transmission whereas the subject mentioned above was relating to a A604/41TE 4 speed box.