Turbo Failure...

[MikeyRules]

Well it looks like my turbo is about to fail!

 

It's still boosting ok, but once the engine is up to temp and when you come off the throttle I get a chatter sound which is getting progressively worse.

 

Rebuilds are coming in around £330 from the better turbo specialists, and new from about £625+vat!!

 

Wish me luck!!

[Rossocorsa]

Sounds rather unfortunate are you sure it's the turbo? I've not heard of much bother with turbos on bravo/delta

[MikeyRules]

Yeah failure of the Garrett GTB1446VZ is rare but one of my friends is the technical director at Universal Turbo's said they have had a couple in for rebuild from the same 1.6jtdm2 engine out of the Mito.

 

It gets diagnosed on the 22nd, so I'll know for sure then, and get it sent to James if that's the case.

 

Basically when you come off boost the variable veins are catching the case by the sounds of things, so possibly a worn bearing?

[Nello]

Thats a shame Mikey - whats your mileage now?

Edited August 13, 2016 by Nello

[MikeyRules]

Thats a shame Mikey - whats your mileage now?

 

Erm good question lol. Think it's only about 35k which is not much really for a turbo failure! Although it is running boost and is driven hard when on the welsh roads around north wales!

[Rossocorsa]

Are you still using a tuning box? I've no idea how yours works but I have read that increasing boost on a car with dpf can be dangerous except short duration at full throttle. This is particularly because apparently on some makes (no idea if fpt is included) during regen the ecu increases the boost so an additional boost from the tuning box would be OTT. Incidentally I tried a tuning box on my car (one that allegedly only increased boost at full throttle) but took it off eventually as it appears that over time the ecu learns its being manipulated(?)and secondly it was emitting radio interference that reduced the dab signal (as do most, maybe all, in car phone chargers!). As I'm not technical no idea if the above about tuning boxes is true just what I read and thought it could be relevant. Edited August 13, 2016 by Rossocorsa

[MikeyRules]

Yep and wouldn't be without one to be honest. One of my friends owns DTUK http://www.diesel-performance.co.uk/

 

There's lots of nonsense out there regarding tuning boxes and a lot of it stems from the remap companies as they don't like the box market stealing their business.

 

I've only ever run Andrew's boxes, so can't comment on the myriad of other product out there. But in the 10 years and 15 cars I've run them on, I've not had any issues at all related from using one. In most cases I've gone a few steps further by increasing the air intake with forced induction, and improved cooling with larger front mounted intercoolers, changed to equally distant manifolds and free flow exhausts, ran water/meth systems and even dry NOS into air intake on a 2.4 5 cylinder diesel Spider...

 

The boxes stay within manufacture parameters, so are a safe bet and well and truly tried and tested...Well DTUK's are...  In the Spider I was running 287bhp and 505lbft of torque, so that was close to the gearbox limits, but other than that ran sweet.

[Rossocorsa]

I've used them before but I just found on the delta that I can't get a reliable and sustainable result ( the performance gains seem to diminish over time as if the ecu learnt to adjust parameters) it was the box manufacturer that said there were issues with dpf equipped cars not a remap supplier. Edited August 13, 2016 by Rossocorsa

[MikeyRules]

I've used them before but I just found on the delta that I can't get a reliable and sustainable result ( the performance gains seem to diminish over time as if the ecu learnt to adjust parameters) it was the box manufacturer that said there were issues with dpf equipped cars not a remap supplier.

When you say 'them' do you mean DTUK or different tech/supplier?

 

So is it your perception that the performance diminishes and the fact you've got used to the power delivery or actual facts from before and after rolling road results?

 

I'm just interested to know as I have never had that problem, other than heat soak over multiple runs on a hub centric rolling road as the first run the air temp is always the coolest. I would love to know which box supplier said they were having problems with DPF as that's a totally new one on me....

[Rossocorsa]

Not dtuk, supplier didn't say they were having problems it's just that they say to be safe they can't apply additional part throttle boost because of possible boost increase by ecu when regenerating. I fit the box and there's a power increase but it appears to dimish as the car 'learns' and if removed after period of time car is barely any slower. Another box may be different but I've decided not to bother as it's adequate as is.

By their very nature boxes are an imprecise art I'm semi tempted by a rolling road remap instead but worried that it's a no way back solution at least with the box you can take it off.

Edited August 14, 2016 by Rossocorsa

[MikeyRules]

Right well the rebuilt turbo is now back on the car as of today, so hopefully that's the end of it...It's had an oil and filter change at the same time for obvious reasons.... Luckily we were away last week so I didn't miss it too much... Although the Mito got rather more of a thrashing through the Welsh countryside than I think it expected! I had to re-learn how to squeeze everyone of the 95 horses out of the naturally aspirated 1.4 which involved way more gear changing than I'd have liked!!

 

Just for future reference I used Universal Turbo's based in Fordingbridge near the New Forest. My friend James is the Technical Director so managed to pull a few strings and get it overnighted to him, fully rebuilt and sent back last week. I can't fault the service and would highly recommend them should you ever need a turbo rebuilding.

 

I'm also lucky to have found Nigel Snape (Master Technician) factory trained (In Italy) in all things Fiat, Lancia, Alfa etc and now working for himself after 25 years in the dealer network. So in essence the best there is but at independent prices. Win Win!! 

[Nello]

Glad you got it sorted Mike 

[Nello]

Hi Mike - as per my other thread when my MA unit failed - my Turbo is making a 'ticking' noise under load - although drives fine and burns no oil I think I may need a replacement unit at some point. Looks like a rebuild might be a better option though. Did you remove yours yourself and a rough idea of the complete cost if you don't mind?

[MikeyRules]

Hi Neil mine was done at mates rates as my friend James is the technical director at Universal Turbo's down in Hampshire.

 

From memory he charged me £295 for a full refurb, that's also pressure tested and warrantied and included next day courier both ways. It went on a Monday and was back by the Friday... although Nigel couldn't re-fit it until the Monday, so the car was off the road for about a week. 

 

I can't remember what he charged me for removal/refit and he also did an oil and filter change at the same time as a precaution.

[Nello]

Mikey - or anyone - My eper Part number for my Turbo is 71724563 - or 564 as the OE replacement. This turbo was also used in the Mito, Punto Evo and Bravo.

I've seen a few other part numbers quoted for these other models but not entirely sure if they are the same units.

Anyone know? 

The problem is if you look for that as a replacement part on ebay you only get a Couple in Germany as these are the Lancia parts numbers and not Chrysler.

[MikeyRules]

Not sure tbh Neil as mine is different being the 1.6 diseasel.

 

Why don't you get yours refurbed like I did? James recons they make them better than new, as some of the OEM parts used are poo.

Edited June 20, 2017 by MikeyRules

[Nello]

Yes I think thats the better option mate - Its just it would mean my mechanic would need to remove / send-off and wait until returned to be fitted so car would need to be there for a week or so......

You recommend Universal Turbos then mate? I've just emailed them mate anyway..............

Edited June 20, 2017 by Nello

[MikeyRules]

Yes I think thats the better option mate - Its just it would mean my mechanic would need to remove / send-off and wait until returned to be fitted so car would need to be there for a week or so......

You reccomend Universal Turbos then mate?

Yeah they have a good reputation from what I've read and I couldn't fault the service when they did mine - Obviously have a look on google etc.

 

Although I know James personally I think although he oversaw the process, it was still the same turnaround as it would have been for anyone else.